Kaim Todner - solicitors
November 2002 Grand Jury Indictment (.pdf)
November 2002 Grand Jury Indictment with all the "censored" IP addresses revealed by "cut and paste".
Virginia Indictment - November 2002 Department of Justice press release
New Jersey Indictment - November 2002 Department of Justice press release
New Jersey indictment - full text
Military Commission Order No. 1 (.pdf) - signed by President George W. Bush, March 21st 2002.
Extradition Act 2003
Computer Misuse Act 1990
Read the Foreign & Commonwealth Office official online and printed copies of the unbalanced USA - UK Extradition Treaty - it even uses American English words and spellings e.g "offenses" and "authorize" !
Extradition Treaty between the UK and the United States of America with Exchange of Notes
Presented to Parliament: June 2007 (.pdf)
Statewatch's analysis of the civil rights defects in the UK-US Extradition treaty
Oral Evidence on UK-US Extradition Treaty given to the House of Commons Select Committee on Home Affairs on 22nd November 2005 given by Senior District Judge Tim Workman; Ms Sally Ireland, Senior Legal Officer, JUSTICE; Andy Burnham MP, Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Home Office
International Extradition Blog - by McNabb Associates a law firm that specialises in international extradition cases.
The Appeal Court Judgement issued on 3rd April 2007 is now online via the BAILII database
The House of Lords Judgment - 30th July 2008:
McKinnon (Appellant) v Government of the United States of America (Respondents) and another
Gary McKinnon's statement to the Director of Public Prosecutions, January 2009, published by Computer Weekly: US took 39 months to demand McKinnon's extradition.
McKinnon v Secretary of State for the Home Department [2009] EWHC 170 (Admin) (23 January 2009) - Oral Hearing which allowed a Judicial review on the Asperger's Syndrome aspects of the case, to be held some time after 16th March 2009
Computer Weekly have published Crown Prosecution Service Review Note 3, which explains some of the reasons why the CPS found insufficient evidence to prosecute Gary in the UK, including some inadmissable hearsay, and doubts that some of the alleged computer foresnic evidence was up to the ACPO guidlines for ensuring an untampered chain of evidence, and doubts about the unproven amount of alleged financial damage being claimed.
The British and Irish Legal Information Institute have published the text of the two combined Judicial Review Judgments made against Gary McKinnon which were handed down on Friday 31st July 2009:
Lord Justice Stanley Burnton and Mr. Justice Wilkie's refusal to allow Gary McKinnon's case to be certified to go up to the Supreme Court on appeal,handed down on Friday 9th October 2009.
McKinnon, R (on the application of) v Secretary of State for Home Affairs [2009] EWHC 2449 (Admin) (09 October 2009)
URL: http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2009/2449.html
Cite as: [2009] EWHC 2449 (Admin)
b*stards
"So much for British Justice"
The verdict has not gone the way Gary, his defenders and legal team would have wished, but this does not represent a failure of British justice.
The lengthy legal due process has been followed. If there is further recourse to appeal, in the UK or Europe, as British citizen, he's entitled to pursue this.
What he is not entitled to assume is that he should not be tried in the country where and against whom his crimes were committed.
It's no excuse that security was 'lax'.
I also find the blatant anti-americanism describing the blog offensive. This case has nothing whatsover to do with Guantanmo bay.
Should other countries not support are extradition appeals based on previous examples of british injustice? Follow that course and there we'd all be left in precarious state.
If there are problems with the way the extradition has been sought, contest these by all means.
But don't forget.
He committed a crime. He knew he committed a crime. I'm also sure he knew the risks.
Stick to a proper defense, based on facts and british law and due process. I'd never heard of the guy until this morning. but I can't imagine for one second some the more extreme viesws on here help one bit.
This is sickening. Poor gary he's off to the warmongering prison nation then for a jail sentence that will far outweigh his crime :(
With the US dictating UK Right wing and Europe dictating UK left, our judicional system is nothing more than a bunch of self appointed, pillow biting traffic wardens.
UK - BE ASHAMED!
I have to agree with David, he commited a crime and is trying to escape from justice
This is very dissapointing. The judgement points in the direction, that it is justful for any military to keep information hidden away from the general public and anyone private person who will attempt to unlock those secrets will be prosecuted and restricted in human rights. Had he discovered some military plot against the UK, would you have done the same to him !? A BIG-BIG SHAME on British Justice.
jail this irresponsible bugger.does he think its funny after 9.11 damaging all their hardware/software which costs the US citizens millions in taxes.give him at least 20years.idiot
I agree that the verdict is a failure of British justice. It's _legally_ correct, but still unjust. And it's only a harbinger of the injustice that awaits Gary in the US.
For all the respect and admiration I have for the US and its culture of freedom, that same US has some very very black patches. Such as a "justice" system with distinctly medieval traits.
Such as revenge and scape-goating. For let there be no mistake: the security on US military computers was, well, practically non-existent. Anyone with a modem and a PC could get into them. But rather than secure its computer systems the US "wants to see Gary fry". Justice? No. Revenge? Yes. Scapegoating? Yes.
For one thing should be quite clear. Mr. McKinnon did not commit a "crime" as some of the more US oriented commetators would have one believe. At most he committed an "offence" or a "misdemeanor", but nothing near a "crime" for which any proportional punishment would be to lock him away for 3 year or so. Not 10-70 years as politically oriented US prosecutors may demand.
Unfortunately for him the US currently favours monstrously disproportional punishment.
And then another thing. Extradition. This is a totally one-side arrangement under which Britons are liable to be handed over to US prosecution on their mere say-so. Having a charge laid against one that might, however tangentially, be construed as coming under the purview of a US court is sufficient. On the other hand no American will be extradited to face prosecution in Britain. Congress has stalled that part of the agreement.
Only when Britain is able to pull any American it wants over here to face prosecution (provided it can make it somewhat plausible that the American in question does in fact have a charge to answer here in the UK) with no more formalities than a request for extradition will the situation be balanced.
Until that is the case I feel that the UK should suspend the extradition treaty.
Whilst he may have committed a criminal act, it would seem appropriate that his punishment be community service.
It hardly warrants a 70-year sentence.
Running perl scripts against .mil domains and NASA machines isn't difficult. I don't believe he deleted any data or disrupted any servers so if they had to be made secure, it was Gary Mckinnon who highlighted the fact.
I also find the US strong-arm tactics abhorrent.
If you commit a crime in a foreign country - don't be surprised when you are asked to stand trial in that country for the offence you committed there.
Gary admits the crime - I wish he'd stop wasting the tax payers money ( ie me and you ) fighting this - suck it up and go face the music.
I hate to think how much this has cost us so far
I am so very sorry that Gary's appeal to the Law Lords was lost. I wish him and his legal team all the best for his appeal to the European Court of Human Rights.
Nothing justifies being made an example of. Gary should face a fair trial, under this 'so-called' justice system.
'He committed a crime. He knew he committed a crime. I'm also sure he knew the risks.' - but who would have ever dreamt that rapists and killers get less time than McKinnon's proposed sentence? What's more important: the lives of humans, or money? clearly, it's the latter of the two.
People shouldn't be afraid of their government - I pray that common sense will prevail. Is this not the perfect illustration of the corruption of a 'free country'?
'This case has nothing whatsover to do with Guantanmo bay.' This has everything to do with Guantanamo Bay. Do you somehow think that it makes a difference that the people there are Muslims? You don't need eyes to see, you need vision!
Follow your flock, David.
@ david - if you have not heard of Gary McKinnon until this morning, then you are unlikely to understand the complexities of the case which involves questions of British sovereignty and the proportionality of Gary's alleged offences.
He could and should have been tried in the United Kingdom - the Computer Misuse Act 1990 applies here in London to alleged computer crimes anywhere else in the world.
This website is not "anti-American", there are many US citizens who have expressed support for Gary
There seems to an attitude amongst the "geek" community that it is ok to go about breaking the law and that somehow the Internet is outside of rules and authority.
This has been demonstrated not only in hacking but also the illegal fire sharing and copyright infringements that are plastered all over the Web.
At the end of the day this guy is not outside the rule of law, he broke it, he should be punished for it.
Let him rot in what ever jail he ends up in and then perhaps the message will hit home abit to other idiots like him.
@ Gary K - what is wrong with Gary McKinnon being tried in the UK, under UK law ? .
With the xenophobic authoritarian mindset of the current US Government, how is possible for him to get a fair trial there ?
David,
it is not anti American, it is anti the current American administration and most Amercians and most of the world are also anti the current US administration which is why they crave change.
It is totally wrong that America can Extradite any British citizen on an allegation alone, whereas the UK cannot extradite any American citizen without proof.
Gary McKinnon has always denied the damage and that is the crux of the matter.
It is not irrelevant to note that when you leave your doors wide open for years on end that you would expect to be burgled and/or your house to be wrecked and if you then complained, everyone would agree that you had been an absolute fool.
In addition; you cannot break into something that is not locked.
Fortunately it was Gary McKinnon that Trespassed and not an actual terrorist that might want to blow us all to Kingdom Come.
Because of the current US government; America is fast becoming a place that disregards Human Rights and gives ridiculous sentences that just don't fit the crime and make us see the American government as an evil, vindictive regime.
On record the US government say that they regard "waterboarding" which is simulated drowning, as not being torture, whereas any civilised person or country clearly knows that this is absolute torture.
Extraditing someone like Gary McKinnon makes a fool of the American Justice system and unfortunately the UK allow the American government to walk all over them.
This so called extradition "treaty" (signed only by the UK)was supposedly to be used only for terrorists but has so far been used mainly against old men and white collar workers, so the House of commons was fooled by Blunket and by the US administration.
Wish we could become independent from the U.S as it seems we are totally ruled by them. This is not a reflection on the American people but a desire to once more become an independent country.
The Law Lords have lost any respect they might have had and the sooner they are abolished the better, as they too are afraid to stand up to America.
Gary McKinnons House of Lords hearing was moved forward three days to coincide with George Bush being in London and Bush and his entourage visited next door to the Lords on the very day and time that Gary McKinnons appeal was being heard.
Conspiracy or just common sense to know that the pressure has once again been put on.
Broke American Law - Goes to Court In America - Goes to JAIL in America - this !@$# put many of my friends in HARMS way -- extradite him.
Lets look at it this way - if a US Citizen was to break into the UK Parliment - where would he/she go to jail? In the UK - where they should!
People need to face reality of their crime - and the consequences.
By the way -- this quote By travesty on July 30, 2008 10:08 AM
This is sickening. Poor gary he's off to the warmongering prison nation then for a jail sentence that will far outweigh his crime :(
Becareful of thowing stones living in glass houses! Lets look at the origan of Australia.... shall we?
BOb P, you say gary put many of your friends in HARMS way, he hasnt killed anyone has he? you government is guilty of murder and put many more of your own soldiers along with innocent people in 'harms' way and often injured or killed.
Also, wheres the evidence that he actually did all that damage, wheres the proof?
I see the George Bush Whackos are back on this website again and they stand out a mile.
The people in charge of the US computer security should be prosecuted as they put the world at risk by leaving their systems unsecured and wide open and very soon the American public will get to hear about it and guess who they'll blame....The American government!!!
We in the UK will make damned sure that the American public and media get to know how negligent their government was for years and years and apparently still are.
The U.S government are in charge of the security of America and they left their systems wide open to every would be terrorist on the planet.
Aren't they lucky it was Gary McKinnon that alerted them, he should be given a medal.
@ bob beater - your comment hoping for US deaths in Iraq is not acceptable on this blog - vent your hatred elsewhere
He gets what he deserves. He dug his own grave. He obviously was messing around where he should not have, and knew it. Should have kept his "searches" for ufo's to google in stead of any government websites. Dont worry, prison will be the safe place for him when "planet x" arrives, lol. Then he can read the news about "ufo's". Google this if he wants the information he was looking for---> Nibiru. Anyway... let his attourney delay his going to prison, only to prolong his stay IN prison.
1. Gary has admitted guilt in crimes he committed in the United States. He should (and definitely will) be tried in America for his crimes. Someone leaving their door unlocked is not a reason to go in the house and take their things. The damages will be disputed at trial.
2. When he is tried in America, he will not be tried in a Military Tribunal. No one ever said he would be. His trial will follow the normal protocol for this type of legal action. His case has nothing to do with terrorism, and he wasn't charged with anything "terrorism" related. The indictment clearly states that he is charged with an assortment of illegal computer activity.
3. Children will starve today. There are people all over the world who's human rights are ACTUALLY being taken away and violated. There are things worth putting up a website about and starting a movement for. This is not one of those things.
This guy is an admitted felon - what's the problem with extradition? This is a low-level matter that has nothing to do with the war on terror or any other issue. He committed a crime and now he's got to do the time. To appeal to the human rights court is a slap in the face to the real victims of human rights. Trying to protect him in that court is a farce - he is an admitted criminal and will be treated humanly in a US prison.
I am in the US, and have followed this story for a while. I am appalled at the idea that his crime bears a sentence of 70 years. As to the $900,000 worth of "damage caused" I have to say this - the way business is done here in the US, that means my government paid $900,000 to contractors to implement a secure network at these government agencies. McKinnon in reality did the US a favor by showing just how ridiculously incompetent they had been in providing security for these systems.
I've run several web hosts, and deployed anti-hacking measures, very simply done, that completely prevented the Perl script Mr. McKinnon used from running - in fact, once the script was recognized, the intruding IP address is banned. It cost me NOTHING to protect my hosted sites, but a bit of time and effort.
Yes, what he did was criminal. But we're talking about the USA here - where exposing a pitifully weak security system gets a 70 year sentence, while exposing a secret CIA Agent (actually an act of treason according to our ignored law) gets immediately commuted, and will be pardoned completely before Bush leaves office. It really sickens me as an American to see what this country has come to. Not all of us are blindly walking off the cliff over here.
In researching today's news, I saw on Wikipedia that McKinnon had committed suicide today, but have been unable to verify that. Does anyone here know? That is unbelievably tragic if true.
lmao are you for real mike? what world do you live in?
Go Gary. I am a US citizen and I believe that this is a waste of US tax dollars and we already know that the US has been in contact with other out of this world Aliens and has been working with them since early 1950's. Even our own Nasa people say it. Gary should be let go and the people in charge of these servers and such that Gary hacked into should be put on trial for not doing their jobs and being paid by US tax dollars.
70 years??? no humanity for that crime. How Long Kevin Mitnick had paid in prison ?
Gary should be born in China, I have no doubt that's no deport from there.
--suport from portuguese guy!
Have to completely agree with most of the oppinions expressed here. Fair enough the guy admitted unlawful entry into American military computers, im not too sure 70 years is justifiable tbh. If the American government can come up with undeniable proof that Gary caused as much damage as is claimed then fair enough, he has dug his own grave. But, as things stand, he is up for charges that warrent no more than a year in prison and / or a fine (again, how can you mental G W Bush fanatics justify 70 years??). And to say that 1 man on a 56kbps modem rendered the US military district of Washington to become inoperable is just fucking laughable imo. And to "m thomson" He admits hacking long before and for a short period after 9/11 and no evidence has or even can be produced for the alleged damage software / hardware. Try reading some stuff before posting ur narrow minded American tripe here on a subject u seem to know nothing about.
@ BANE - incredibly, in one short comment, you have managed to incite both Racial and Religious hatred and to incite both individual and mass Murder !
You are as bad as Abu "The Hook" Hamza al-Masri, who got sentenced to 7 years in prison for similar ranting.
Needless to say you have also broken the Acceptable Use Policy of your ISP, and a formal complaint is on its way.
i cant believe that there are some people on here who seem to honestly think that gary McKinnon should receive the punishment that America want to give him,he is guilty of nothing more than being nosy,and if you watch interviews with him he was only looking on these computers looking for proof of hidden energy sources covered up by America and no doubt the uk.The fact that they wish to give him up to 70 years is a complete sign of the times,400 years ago people were being hunted,charged and killed for being a "witch" in America and now all that has changed is"uncle sam" has a suit and a legal system that is not only unfair but dishonest and unsafe.its a modern day witch hunt but now "terrorists" and people like gary are the "criminals" i am absolutly no way condoning what gary did or saying that terrorism is not a serious matter,what i am saying is America and the u.k. are bulling and controling us for reasons that are unfair.
|| By Steve on July 30, 2008 8:52 PM
Have to completely agree with most of the oppinions expressed here. Fair enough the guy admitted unlawful entry into American military computers, im not too sure 70 years is justifiable tbh. If the American government can come up with undeniable proof that Gary caused as much damage as is claimed then fair enough, he has dug his own grave. But, as things stand, he is up for charges that warrent no more than a year in prison and / or a fine (again, how can you mental G W Bush fanatics justify 70 years??). And to say that 1 man on a 56kbps modem rendered the US military district of Washington to become inoperable is just fucking laughable imo. And to "m thomson" He admits hacking long before and for a short period after 9/11 and no evidence has or even can be produced for the alleged damage software / hardware. Try reading some stuff before posting ur narrow minded American tripe here on a subject u seem to know nothing about. ||
I agree with Steve. Extradition laws should be reciprocated. Gary broke a law and got caught, so in some way he will have to be made accountable to the US; which is not going to happen in a UK court.
I can't imagine that he could have made too much damage using a perl script and a 56k modem. I saw a report that he made 500k - 600k worth of damage, a figure I can image is highly inflated. To do that much damage using a 56k modem and a perl script is ridiculous and really points to the incompetence of the US military.
All in all this trial should be about accountability not revenge.
I believe that the research that Gary McKinnon was undertaking when he pushed at an open door which was left conveniently ajar by the US military and NASA,was in the public interest. I believe these charges to be largely trumped up and unreasonable.
I also consider that Gary McKinnon's human rights as a British citizen have not been upheld in the British courts and I support his wish to take his case to the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.
It is my view that the British government and judicial system has caved in to pressure from the US government, who perhaps rightly believe that they would have a more difficult task in a British court of proving that their computers were 'damaged' by McKinnon's hacking.
The alleged damage is of course at the heart of the US government's case against him.
It concerns me that Mr McKinnon could face extradition to a country whose president endorses the use of torture and where Habeus Corpus has been suspended.
Had Mr McKinnon hacked into the Burmese government computers for example, I doubt we would be sending him there to face trial.
Extradition to the United States is in my view morally no different.
I think we should put Mr Mckinnon's alleged offences into perspective.
I also think he should be tried under British legislation in the UK and not be sent to the United States where I fear his legal and human rights will be put in jeopardy.
The British government did not send Salman Rushdie to Iran when the fatwa was pronounced against him, but it now seems quite happy to acquiesce to the demands from Washington for Mr Mckinnon's head.
So in Britain a weak government in turmoil caves in to a lame duck US presidency and the scapegoat for this catalogue of disasters is to be Gary McKinnon.
One would hope that the British political and legal establishment would have had more about them than that, because this is just an elaborate charade I think.
It goes against the European convention on Human Rights to extradite persons to countries where torture is carried out. The US has sanctioned Waterboarding (Drowning) as an interrogation tool against terror suspects. Gary is to be treated as a terror suspect as they have told him already. The US will be blocked by the European court in his extradition because of the brutality imposed in the US by a rougue government deep in over their heads in cover up after cover up.
The "damage" that was alleged to have been done was probably hiring IT people to put passwords on all their machines and then do an audit on what information on UFO's was leaked. Go to Project Camelot website and it's all there anyway from witnesses and insiders. I reckon they;re making an example out of Gary but the European Court will win the day for Gary - as they are not in totally league with the US government.
The US is hiding anti gravity technology and free energy devices that would do away with oil, petrol, gas, nuclear power stations, war, famine, poverty and inequality. Gary was trying to unearth this information as physical proof of the cover up by the black ops projects of the US Gov't. I personally salute Gary for his noble intentions of bringing this free energy out into the open. (although there's loads of information on it anyway on the internet) However, a crime of "damage" has been reported. As far as I can remember, no software has ever caused damage to hardware. So the damage must be to software related. At the time there were people all over the world trying to hack into the NASA websites - some of them may have caused "damage" so how could they pin all of it on Gary if the whole hacking world was getting in too? The NASA we have known for the past 50 years has been a lie anyway - Read Dark Mission by Richard Hoagland and you will see that NASA is indeed covering up UFO's, free energy and the like. Shame on NASA and and illuminati law lords.
I'm absolutely digusted with this... I hope the fucking twats pay if he goes to the electric chair.
You donot know what you are talking about
People believe in ferry tales
He wanted to know about cover ups of UFOS
wait please you wil sea what comes
and mind my words.
The pentagon has lost 320 trillion dollar
Where are they
Garry maybe knows
They are criminals in the pentagon
Garry is a freedom fighter
The american empire is over
OUr liberty is in danger
It is the intention that counts!
The human dimension
So If some body goes to war on lies but has the law behind him he klils innocent people he can go on?
Garry is no issue
When can commun sense please come back in our society
He must be set FREE
He is a freedom fighter not a criminal.
wher is democracy
We the people have the right to know what is hidden by governements
it is with our money!
How can we help?
This is appalling! The US wanted to be independent from Britain, now they're asking for out citizens who broke the law in BRITAIN. What's the world coming to, and what's wrong with a fair trial in BRITAIN.
The American's are claiming he damaged their system, which in reality means they had to fix their security flaws... and now their charging him for that!
Is it me or is anyone else of the thought that if it was any other information he was trying to get the British government would have accepted his appeal?
Its all part of an 'ET/UFO' cover up by the worlds government! And please note Gordon Brown hasn't even expressed his views on this case, or have NASA or the US government over Dr Edgar Mitchell's interview on Kerrang Radio!
Something's not right, anyone can see that!!
And before anyone warns me not to go against the system, that's what the systems for. If no-one had ever gone against the system we wouldn't know anything about UFO's, we wouldn't know about the Big Bang and we probably wouldn't know the majority of scientific things we do.
What can we do to help Gary?
I say contact your Local MP, and your local European MP's...
Not sure what they can do, but its got be worth a try if everyone on here gets their points of views seen by the government, they have to at least consider taking action!
I agree that the charges laid against him sound skewed, but I highly doubt that with the current state of the UK -USA's love affair along with the amount of publicity and money that has gone into the case that Gary will not have to face up to some accountability.
The only chance he has are with the European Human Rights Court where I really do hope he is successful in his endeavors.
There are so many worldwide military and government officials that have disclosed their witness accounts to the public of the suppression of ET and free-energy technologies that you cannot ignore them - To do so is just ignorance.
US military and Nasa are hiding serious UFO information
http://www.aurionmission.blogspot.com/2008/07/us-military-and-nasa-are-hiding-serious.html
"To civil liberty groups, McKinnon is a UFO believer whose enthusiasm got the better of his admittedly limited judgement, and whose chief crime was mere electronic trespass. He is just a nut, to whom a superpower's sledgehammer is now being unnecessarily – and vindictively – applied.
The Americans see things rather differently. His actions were, said one US prosecutor, "the biggest military computer hack of all time". According to the Justice Department indictment, he, among other things, "broke into the computer network at the Earle Naval Weapons Station, stealing computer passwords, and shutting down the network in the immediate aftermath of the September 11 terrorist attacks"; and he caused "approximately $900,000 [£450,000] in damages to computers"." .... http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/computer-crime-he-may-be-a-nerd-but-hes-ours-883642.html
What specific damage to computers would that be?
And electronic trespass is only an Intellectual misdemeanour born out of Ignorance and who would wish to punish that ..... whenever the Crime is to put Weapons of Mass Destruction Systems Management on the Internet for any Tom, Dick or Harry to find. The Department of Defence wants to kick its own Ass for being so Dumb. Intelligence is not a Crime, and in fact, it is something which they freely admit they are looking for..... and it and IT Skills are surely missing in their Systems Management as is evidenced by Global Events under their Management.
What Plonker instituted this Prosecution which draws even further attention to Vulnerabilities in their Defensive Posture? A Foreign Mole working Deep Under Cover?
As I suggested a week or so ago, I wrote to my local MP...
I received a reply in the form of a letter today...
"Dear Mr Course
Thank you for your email regarding Gary McKinnon's appeal against extradition.
Although Gary McKinnon was actually in the UK when he committed what was alleged to be a crime, that crime was against United States institutions and they are entitled to seek extradition in the same way as we are entitled to seek extradition in the same way as we are entitled to seek extradition of their citizens in reverse.
I understand that Gary McKinnon is considering an appeal to the European Court of Human rights and I have no idea weather this will be successful.
Internet crime brings a whole new dimension to international relations, however, I would hope that you would accept that somebody should not be allowed to reside abroad and commit criminality via the Internet or via the postal system and be immune to prosecution. It is therefore essential that different countries work together and co-operate with each other. The USA and Great Britain do so with lots of people being extradited in both directions in any one year.
Yours sincerely
The Rt Hon Bob Ainsworth MP
Coventry North East"
So basically he isn't going to do anything about it... it was worth a try i guess...
@ Jamie C - thanks for trying, but there is little an MP can do at this stage,
Bob Ainsworth neglects to mention that Gary could easily have been tried in the UK under the Computer Misuse Act 1990, so there is no question of
applying at all.
Nobody has ever been extradited for computer hacking offences, in either direction.
I might have to send him another email with your points in... and I sent very similar emails to the local European MPs but with no reply... maybe there's something going to come out of that?
but I doubt it...
The Sub-Prime/Credit Crunch fiasco, which is nowhere near finished running its course, and which originated in the the Financial Markets of the USofA has cost billions, if not even trillions to be "lost", and are there any Wall Street executives/dodgy bankers languishing in Federal jails, reflecting on their Scams and Crimes which are adversely affecting millions?
Time to wake up and smell the coffee and tell Uncle Sam to ........ put its house in Order first before they start throwing their weight around elsewhere.
Time for those particular Law Lords to be put out to pasture, methinks, for they aint thinking nearly well enough to sit in Judgment as Peers.
And whenever you know ..
a)how the Great Game is played, and
b)how the Internet is Played ....
then is the judgment even more perverse.
A change of US Heart might be a very wise move in their very distressed and precarious State.
fg, what are Gary's thoughts on the Law Lords ruling against him? I hope that you post on this site, more of what Gary's doing and his thoughts. This may sound stupid, but, I hope that Gary starts working out with weights and putting in road work (long distance running, even if on a treadmill). It'll help his mind as well as his body.
Another thing, the current British government seems to have embraced the New World Order with a One World Government led by the U.S. I think that the European Union is more independent minded and will rule in Gary's favour. His loss with his own government must be a big blow, but, the E.U. could be a whole different case, instead of just an appeal of the case in the U.K.
In addition to Gary strengthening his mind by using his body through excersize, he should develope his mind directly through remote viewing (clairvoyance) and continuing to learn about extraterrestrials. Britons in the past have been imprisoned in foreign countries and when they returned, they were stronger and continued helping others.
In other words, fighting the U.S. and U.K., U.F.O. cover-up and injustice, is Gary's thing and I hope that he fights to the end, at least 40 more years, most of it in Britain.
He should be judge under british law, otherwise is clearly a human right breaking. The only reason he faces extradition to USA is because UK does anything USA orders them do, either punish their own citizens with 70 years jail for hacking or starting a war without previuos attack, because of USA oil interest strategy.
Should he broke into other country's computer, he will be fearing nothing; so the point is not to break into other's people computer's but to intrude the house of your master (ergo, you UK citizens are slaves of USA as this case is proving)
It is amazing tha the Echelon networkg does precisely so: to intrude in other peoples computers. This network is promoted by USA, UK, Australia and the like. I like to know if any of the responsibles people of this net has/will ever face what Gary did.
Proud people of the UK: do not allow further intrusion of USA goverment into your lives. Say yes to the USA, but say not toh slavery their rulers put on you.
Clara, from Barcelona
I think that the government in the UK are just to lazy to deal with him themselves so they're sending him off to the USA wich proves that they think the USA is better than the UK. I hate the lazy f*ckers that call themselves the government.
I would like to see the US governments breakdown of the damage that was caused to their computers. It has been kept (I assume intentionally) vague about the details of the case. Seem to me that poacher turned gamekeeper would be an apt analagy in this case.
I don't think it's fair to say he has damaged any computers. This is a claim by the US and has not been proven. You can't make a computer explode via the internet! They probably couldn't use them because of the security breech, not because they didn't work. Even if he deleted some OS files, if they didn't have a disaster recovery plan or backup, that's their fault. He has damaged nothing but America's ego. They should give the man a job so they can fix their security loopholes! Asses!
Gary McKinnon would appear to have been foolish, but his foolishness pales into insignificance when compared to the utter cretinism exhibited by politicians on both sides of the Atlantic.
Definition of politics?
Composed of 2 roots:-
Poly, meaning many.
Tick, meaning bloodsucking parasite.
*IF* anti-gravity, free energy, and spaceships exist... and it was apparently very easy for Gray to hack into areas where this information was, then surely the professional Intelligence departments of China, Russia, etc have acquired this information? I can understand the US keeping such info secret but I cannot understand why all Governments worldwide would keep this information secret. China is well known for hacking. I am sure China regularly attempts to deviously acquire secret information from the US. Gary continually maintains it was EASY to perform his hack, but conveniently he got absolutely NO PROOF to substantiate his claims. Considering the fact that no other Governments openly possesses such advanced technology (they would have easily acquired it if it exists) I surmise it simply does not exist. I am inclined to believe Gray was performing malicious hacks. I believe that when Gray was apprehended he invented his preposterous tales about UFOs, free-energy, anti-gravity etc. I think Gary has created a preposterous smokescreen to cover-up his anti-US hacks. The image or a nerdy bumbling fool fits with a UFO-nutter incompetently attempting to gather info, but Gary could also be a psychotic-terrorist-sympathiser. The fact that Gary acquired no evidence could suggest there was ACTUALLY *no evidence* and his bumbling failure to cover his tracks could be due to psychosis. Having said this I think evidence must always presented regarding extradition. It is a gross injustice to present no evidence especially when US prosecutors are allegedly saying Gary should fry for his alleged crimes. The US is undoubtedly corrupt but this does not mean Gary is exempt from corruption. In situations like this is it is very difficult to know who is telling the truth therefore despite my suppositions I maintain an open mind about both Gary and the US. There is no clear solution to this issue therefore I think it would be best if Gary had his court trial in the UK where the justice system is marginally fairer, where abuses of human rights are less prevalent. Guantanamo Bay is a vile place of depravity and gross cruelty.
Considering the dispicable murder of four C.I.A. Operatives, three C.I.A. Agents (contract workers), and one C.I.A. Double Agent or Triple Agent (or Russian Agent as a Iranian Cut Out (C.O) with ties to Chechnia), last week in Afghanistan (it's not as complicated as it would be if the Jordanian\C.I.A. Double\Triple Agent had been working for British and\or Pakistani Intelligence), I'm no longer surprised that Gary was able to exploit weaknesses in the U.S.D.O.D.N.S.A. alphabet soup Alice in Wonderland computer defenses. I'm an American and know that Europeans would be appalled at the weaknesses in U.S. Intelligence.
Put it another way, humans do have extraterrestrial technology. But, it's not the Americans. Gary should have done his lawful "silent" penetrations (in and out - in and out...) in Russia. You have to admit, they know how to keep a secret.
@ Honeybear - "in Russia. You have to admit, they know how to keep a secret."
They are no better at it than anyone else.
Their centralised government culture of secrecy, snooping and state terror and repression is tempered by widespread corruption, and has been hugely damaging to the people of Russia, and the rest of the world.
Gary McKinnon has no links with any Russian organised criminal gangs or intelligence agencies, whatsoever.