The official listing of forthcoming hearings by the Law Lords has now been published online:
JUDICIAL SITTING FOR TRINITY TERM 2008 (.pdf)(Tuesday 3 June - Thursday 31 July)
(Sittings commence: 11.00 am on Monday, 10.30 am on Tuesday - Thursday)
Monday 16 JuneCommittee Room 1
McKinnon (Appellant) v Government of the United States (Respondents) and another
Lord Phillips of Worth Matravers
Lord Scott of Foscote
Baroness Hale of Richmond
Lord Brown of Eaton-under-Heywood
Lord Neuberger of Abbotsbury
Members of the Public are allowed to watch the proceedings of a Law Lords hearing - see the Watch judicial hearings web page.
The House of Lords acts as a Supreme Court of Appeal for the UK. Full-time professional judges called the Law Lords hear public judicial hearings. Anyone can attend a judicial hearing and there is no need to arrange access in advance.
When, where and what are they like?
Hearings run throughout the year and take place from Monday to Thursday.
When hearing appeals, around five Law Lords meet in an Appellate Committee, which is usually located in Committee Room 1. The Law Lords hear about 85 appeals a year.
The hearings are relatively informal. Judges dress in business suits rather than robes and sit around a horseshoe table on the same level as those attending.
Appeals being heard and directions
[...]
If you are coming to watch a judicial hearing please inform a visitor assistant or a police officer when you arrive at St Stephen's entrance - they will direct you to the right queue.
Given the numbers of tourists and the long queues to get though the airport style security at the main St Stephens entrance, you need to get there an hour beforehand, i.e. 10:00 am ahead of the 11:00am start on a Monday, as the space for the public and the media is limited in the Committee Rooms, and is on a first come, first served basis.
As you would expect from the most senior Judges in the UK, they sit on the Crossbenches (i.e. neither the Government nor the Opposition) in the House of Lords, and never vote on legislation, although they occasionally speak or present a report.
Lord Phillips of Worth Matravers is Master of the Rolls, i.e. the third most senior Judge in England and Wales just below the Lord Chancellor (a politician) and the Lord Chief Justice.
Lord Brown of Eaton-under-Heywood currently was until recently as the Intelligence Services Commissioner, who is supposed to investigate the activities of the UK intelligence agencies MI5 the Security Service, MI6 the Secret Intelligence Service and GCHQ (the UK partner of the US National Security Agency) and the UK military, with regard to electronic snooping and interception of communications or other forms of surveillance, covert human intelligence sources etc.
Given that his Annual Reports to Parliament have never criticised any of these agencies, dies that mean that he is likely to be inherently sympathetic to the US Government ?
Baroness Hale of Richmond, Lord Brown of Eaton-under-Heywood and Lord Neuberger of Abbotsbury also recently sat on the European Arrest Warrant appeal, which overturned a writ of Habeas Corpus, and allowed the Extradition of Farid Hilali to Spain, which may prove to be of relevance in whether they decide to trust any promises or assurances given by the US Government.
Hopefully these particular law Lords will be reminded of the fact that the Spanish authorities ignored and flouted their Judgment, once they had their prisoner in their power - Judgments - In re Hilali (Respondent) (application for a writ of Habeas Corpus). The UK Law Lords had ruled that Hilali should only be extradited to face the more serious of the two charges against him in Spain, and not the lesser, probably easier to prove one. All the evidence that case is also purely electronic and international, as with Gary McKinnon's case.
The Spanish authorities have utterly ignored this UK Law Lords judgment and have perversely done exactly the opposite - charged Hilali with the lesser offence, and not the one which the UK Law Lords permitted him to be extradited on.
Baroness Hale's hopes for "... a spirit of mutual trust and respect and not in a spirit of suspicion and disrespect" seem to have been dashed. Once bitten, twice shy ?
If the Judgments of the Law Lords are not even respected and obeyed by fellow European Union countries like Spain, why should they be respected or obeyed by the United States government ?
It is usually several weeks or months after a hearing, before the Law Lords actually publish a Judgment in this, or any other, case before them.
Ernst Gruengast
The current US record on upholding civil liberties is in addition much worse than that of Spain and has got legally much worse since the beginning of gary's case. See:
http://www.counterpunch.com/roberts06032008.html
for example.
The Sami al Arian case in particular is a fine precedent of trumped-up charges, dishonoured promises and kangaroo courts which should even make english law lords shudder. just a thought.
yours respectfully,
ernst
Tab Goode
Oh for God's sake, why don't they catch the peadophiles who stalk and abuse children, instead of this nice young man who was only searching for the truth about UFOs?
He's got good computer skills, they should give him a job instead. Those stupid american b******s.
Andrew Johnson
See this page for additional background:
http://www.exopolitics.org.uk/core%11exopolitics/united%11kingdom/support-required-%11-gary-mckinnon-lords-hearing/
I sent his letter to the Law Lords last week - fax 020-7219 2476.
Edit end use if it you wish.
=======================================
Re: Gary McKinnon Appeal Hearing
Dear Law Lords,
I am writing with regard to the proposed extradition of British Citizen Gary McKinnon for offences related to computer mis-use (hacking) in the late 1990’s and early 2000’s.
I must ask you to overrule Judge Nicholas Evans’s decision of 10th May 2006 to allow extradition. There are a number of grounds on which the only sensible course of action should be judged:
1. As far as I am aware, the extradition treaty between the UK and the USA has not been ratified by the US Congress and therefore should not be binding (we are therefore not obliged to allow the extradition).
2. Gary has confessed to a crime and should be prosecuted on this basis – in this country. It would seem that his prosecution has not been carried forward, so that the extradition treaty (void though it is) would seem to allow his extradition (i.e., if I interpret the treaty correctly, if a defendant has been prosecuted for a crime, he cannot be extradited for it). It is a complete mystery why the CPS has not moved forward with the prosecution and this in itself should be the subject of an investigation.
3. Gary was originally arrested in 2002 and it was said at the time he would face something like 6 months community service. Following a trip to the USA by Police, this “suddenly” became a much longer sentence.
4. Gary has already been “strung along” by the system for the last 4 years – even though he has confessed to his crime. This should count already as a “suspended sentence”.
5. As far as I am aware, the prosecution have produced no tangible evidence of the damage he caused.
6. Gary has disclosed the methods he used to obtain access to the systems concerned. What he did was akin to walking around a neighbourhood, looking for open doors and windows (which he found) and then going in and having a look around inside. Of course, this can be viewed as a type of trespassing – so why does this attract such a stiff sentence?
7. There are Human Rights laws to be considered here – and as such, for example, I have previously sent a copy of this letter to Amnesty International, whom I hoped would offer some input into this matter.
8. Gary has clearly stated what his intentions were and it seems to me that there should be much stronger indications that Gary’s intent was malicious before extradition was allowed. From my own research (which has been ongoing for perhaps a period of 10 years), I know, through expert witness testimony, that what Gary says he found does indeed exist. (I would refer you to Donna Hare’s Disclosure Project testimony from 2001 which partly corroborates McKinnon’s findings).
So, when you have considered these 8 points, I hope that you will realise that allowing extradition would basically mean:
Seeing a punishment administered which does not fit the crime.
A disregard of Human Rights.
A contravention of law, as there is none which has been finalised to allow extradition to take place.
Please make the correct decision – for Gary’s sake, the sake of the law, national sovereignty and human rights.
Yours Most Sincerely,
Andrew Johnson
Amanda Hulse
Gary should be able to stay in the U.K. he has been punished enough. We need to look after each other in life.
Human being
my heart goes out to gary i hope hes in good spirit..........fingers crossed it goes his way.
James
The whole issue is very unreal, i'd expect it in a movie or something.
I listened to Gary on kerrang and the whole debate is stupid and signing a law so that Americans can take us as they wish?
We seem like a tool to America now, and gary seems to be at the recieving end of the tools.
Best of luck Gary i really will view this case after your sitting and i hope you suceed and so do the rest of us!
Lucy
This is Gary's partner and i would like to say a huge thankyou to everybody who is supporting Gary and his family through this time. As you can imagine, to have Gary taken aware from us would be devestating and to think of my life without him, well i just can't let that enter my head. Please show that England has a heart on Monday and the Lords make the right decision not just for Gary but for anyone who finds themselve fighting for their freedom! x
patrizia
Hello,
just to let you know that I have written to James Whale and asked him to invite Gary, since his hearing is due next week.
Best of luck for next week, Gary.
And be strong, Lucy!!! We won't let them win!!!
Barry Commander
Hi, how has he suffered enough? I'm sure he's profited from all the interviews he's done and considered his "hacks" were meant to be for full disclosure - it's odd he's not published anything of any interest. Why shouldn't he be punished for breaking the law and being so flippant and proud of the fact?
Barry
fg
@ barry - you obviously have little experience of media interviews - most of them involve no money, or perhaps only travel expenses.
Who knows if he found anything which you would consider interesting or not ? Who cares ?
Of course Gary should be punished for breaking the law, he has accepted that, but it should be British law, after a fair trial here in the United Kingdom.
Josie
Of course Gary, his partner and his family have suffered enough. This has been hanging over their heads for six years and every morning on waking, they are gripped by fear of the possibilty that Gary will be sentenced to sixty years and will die in a hardline US prison. Six years of constant pressure and worry takes its toll and Gary has had heart problems because of the stress.
Of course he shouldn't have hacked into the Pentagon and he's far from smug about it and says that he wished he hadn't and would never do it again.
However the US military computers are hacked into every day and their security is incredibly bad. Why don't they pay for the kind of security that banks have, it's the Pentagon after all, they should have the best security in the world.
Gary is a pacifist. He didn't hurt anyone, didn't rape or murder anyone but was looking for UFO's.
US sentences are way out of proportion to the crime, which is why the US is earning a name for gross unfairness, particularly towards foreign nationals. They should show some generousity of spirit in this case and they would earn some respect.
Richard
This is absolutely outrageous.
Am I right in assuming that Gary gained access to US military computers through unsecured remote desktop connections? If anything, it should be the individuals responsible for the security of the US military network that are brought to justice here, not Gary.
He is not a terrorist and poses no threat to them whatsoever. It sounds like he was an inquisitive individual with an interest in technology that is being made of scapegoat.
Their claims of 'damage' are ludicrously inflated and it could be argued that they are now wiser now that these stupid holes in their security have been revealed to the world.
Why on earth aren't these computers safely concealed behind an IP-restricted VPN? Further to this, if the information is that sensitive, it should not even be connected to the Internet *at all*.
Gary should not be sent to the US, he should not be treated as a terrorist, give him a job doing something useful instead.
Dan
I'm sitting here at work refreshing the blog to keep up to date! I wish Gary the best of luck today.
I work on military IT systems, and I'm all to aware of the security threats. I spend most of my time developing protocols and barriers to cover all threat vectors! For the US government to overlook all the issues in play, and have un-protected systems on the Internet, is just disgusting.
Gary shouldn't be tried for this crime - the person responsible for IT security should be.
G Aula
Why US is keep on asking for Extradition, Dont they have trust in our British Jury ...if not than why should we truth them ?????????? Gary shouldn't be handed over.
Toby
Solo, how can they do this to you?? They should be trying to employ you, not put you in a prison. If you can hack in so easily, think what the information on those PC's could do in the wrong hands, if someone like Iran hacked in the same way you did. They should get you on thier side to close up all these holes!
I wish you all the best for the trial and there is no question that you should be tried in the UK courts. Think about it - if an American had hacked into the MOD network, would they be extradited over here? Hell no! We have to stand up to the US once in a while!
Good luck solo!
Gary Newell
As far as I can tell the crime was committed in the UK and therefore any trial and subsequent punishment should be in the UK and according to UK law.
Ok the US can give evidence at the trial but that is their sole part.
If a Brit is killed in America by an American that American does not come over here to stand trial and would not serve their punishment here.
This comes down to the US not trusting our legal system. (Not sure I can blame them with a lot of things).
45 years for a crime like this. It does seem draconian.
If Gary had committed the crime whilst in the US then he could be made to serve punishment in the US because whilst you are in another country you abide by their rules.
As far as I'm concerned there is no further case to answer. Gary you are free to go.
Dave, Leeds
Trying hard to get the words out to explain my disgust with the country over the pond!
Bottom line, he hacked/had a look into a company who are the Pentagon, whoppieee, good for him to get in and show how lax there systems are. Who the .... do they think they are!!!! Before all the legal expenses toing and froing, let the fella out and give him a bloody job!
Tell you what, the world is going to s***! I was on a Ethical Hacking lecture the other week, all it is, is curiosity abit like that film about 30 years ago about that kid that hacked into there system! USA/UK get a grip!
Andy
Gary has skills that make most governments nervous. He has managed to enter systems that should be un-enterable, it's a shame the US government has to "make a show" of Gary rather than spending the time, effort and money securing their clearly open systems.
From a UK perspective, our government should be conducting it's own trial, fairly and objectively. What damage was ACTUALLY done? In most trials of hackers (e.g. Kevin Mitnick) the charges are 'embellished' to make a point.
Extradition...maybe the UK / US governments should employ him!! He has certainly bettered their so called experts.
adam brown
well to be honest i think that hes pointed out how low the systems are in USA and instead of trying to get him think they better sort out security problems don't you???????
Static
You have committed a crime, Just like all the other criminal. "oh you didn't have any security"... thats your excuse eh..... YOU invaded my space. YOU broke into my house. Would it be nice if all the burglars got off because you didn't have a 50 thousand dollar security system protecting your home!
Go to JAIL, serve you time like a man.
Mathew Bevan
Again this comes around... and again I smell the whiff of a farce in the air..
Nice how Mr Bush is in the country... I am pretty sure the lords wont want to be pissing him off as they will probably be dining at some lavish banquet later this evening..
Lucy.. my heart goes out to you.. I know what a strain my case had on my late wife and can only empathise with your situation... I wish I could do more.. but it seems all that can be done is being done and aside from supportive interviews... its in the hands of the maso.. lords for the moment...
Love and light.. Kuji
marginal
There has to be prison involved somewhere along the line. If it were as simple as hacking into US Defense systems and popping a dialogue box saying "Peeka Boo" or something benign, then prison would be extreme.
However, the deliberate damage and continued attacks, prove this was more than just a bit of white-hatting.
The law in the UK should cover this provided the US hand over their evidence... If they don't then I can't see a fair trial.
You're gonna need a good lawyer, the State Department has been hopping up and down for a while now.
fg
Today's Law Lords hearing is not actually about the alleged computer hacking case at all.
Their Lordships are considering whether or not an illegal (in the United Kingdom) "hardball" plea bargaining attempt involving threats was made by the US prosecutors or not.
As an additional complication, a couple of former US Government prosecutors and the former FBI agent and Legal attache at the US Embassy in London, at least two of whom now seem to work for Microsoft, are challenging the honour and reputation of Gary's legal team.
They are basically calling Edmund Lawson QC one of the top British barristers a liar, by claiming that the plea bargaining threat conversations at the US Embassy to which he was a witness, as he has stated during the Appeal Court hearings, somehow never took place.
That is why David Pannick QC, who is the top barrister for appeals to the House of Lords was acting on Gary's side, in case he had to cross examine Edmund Lawson as a witness.
If the former US Government officials are deemed to have perjured themselves in their affidavits to the House of Lords, then they could themselves be facing extradition to the UK.
mp
One thing I find truly amazing is that the US government would actually want the details of the intrusions made known in open court. If Gary has to testify in his defence, I imagine it will be highly embarassing to the military.
This is of course assuming that he'd be allowed a trial in open court as opposed to a military tribunal. I wish that last statement was merely paranoia on my part. In any case good luck Gary - I have a gut feeling that we'll soon be throwing a victory party for you.
Lark
Obviously the U.S are scared of people like Gary. Either there are many things which they want to keep secret (very possible) or there are things they believe to have been uncovered. I wouldn't be surprised if they are in a hissy fit over the fact that someone got into their system and not just that they found something.
The Chinese are all over their systems anyway according to themselves, which suggests they need to put more protection on them and be worried about security as a whole, not just one person who has been caught.
rabid robot
Having followed and even offered my assistance to Gary from the start of this sorry affair I continue to do so and a point everyone should be aware of..
source wiki
"The controversy stems from the absence of any reciprocal arrangement in respect of the United States. Therefore at the present time there is no requirement on the U.S. to provide prima facie evidence when requesting the extradition of UK residents, both foreign nationals and UK citizens, but as provided by the UK Act it maintains the requirement for the UK to provide such evidence to the U.S. in the reverse situation. This was the subject of concern prior to the passing of the legislation, and a cause of controversy when it has been applied."
How long are we to allow this INFANT child America to stamp on this world and take what it DEEMS fit in nothing short of continuing war crimes and detention of people which is totally illegal.
Gary's case is nothing different and threats of "FRYing" someone should be listened to very very seriously by the lords of this country.
Slowly the mask is slipping on the united states and I only hope that change is true with a new president to lead the MAJORITY SANE peoples who I have no ill will for to a better America and a more FAIR America.
If they were sensible a lot could have been learned from Gary to close problems like this in their network without any fuss which only made the general public aware of such FLAWS in the bald eagle framework of things.
Gary I salute you and best of luck.
phrack
Speaking on behalf of the hacking community.
The hacking technique used was not advanced enough for the US government to feel threatened. Knowing about default passwords and how poor XP is on a standard install is what any IT techie would know...yes even someone who works in PC World!
The question is...
Should someone be fried for 45 years in a prison cell for being curious? Hackers are naturally curious people, they like to see whats going on under the surface. Gary clearly isnt the malicious blackhat type they are making him out to be. So the 45 years thing is just plain stupid.
Sure Gary needs to realise that hacking into computers is not what to do, especially when governments are involved. But I'm pretty sure by now he has got that message? I mean jesus this thing is getting out of control.
However the person who should be held accountable for this is both Gary and the IT secuity team at the government. Gary simply exposed the holes which should not have been there in the first place. The US gov would do better firing the guy who rolled out the systems there, or even better? Not use Windows, hire a _real_ security guy and spend the money on hardening the network and worrying about real threats.
Good luck Gary, I hope you get off lightly.
Anonymous
Honeybear
Anonymous, as a representative of the hacker community and a supporter of Gary, you should let Gary's legal team know that as of last week, the U.S. C.I.A. web-site had a "gate-keeper" attached to at least one of its HTML tags in one of its forms web-pages. Thomas Bean, in his e-article about the suspicious death of C.I.A. agent, Roland Victor Corydon, this May in Houston, Texas, mentioned that the C.I.A's computer system is compromised by "gatekeepers" that have been put there by at least one foreign intelligence service.
Mr. Bean posted his warning last May about the C.I.A. computers being hacked with "gate-keepers." Last week when I submitted a form on the C.I.A. the message in one of its boxes was diverted or lost twice and I received an erroneous error message. That indicated, that after all the attempts to extradite Gary for hacking into US government computers and threatening and violating Gary's rights, they don't really care. Gary's hack occured about 4 years ago, Mr. Bean posted his warning just last May, and I found a gate-keeper on the CIA, only last week.
The US intelligence (I follow Peter Wright's convention of using a lower-case i when referring to the Americans) community doesn't really care about the "safety and security" of its computer system and getting Gary is just a game to them.
There's really no need for a hacker community given America's lacksidasical computer security and you can help Gary alot more using your vast IT talents in the open. I had never heard of a "gate-keeper" until a few days ago; but now, this knowledge can help Gary. You too, can do more above ground.
http://sutherlandsalute.blogspot.com/2008/05/murdered-cia-agent-houston-pd-in-bed.html
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=C.I.A.+agent+Houston&btnG=Search
http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data/government/homeland_security_patriot_act_fema/news.php?q=1209752871
Lorna Scott
Re-comments by Static: If anyone is stupid enough to leave the door of their home wide open, it's pretty obvious that they would be burgled and would feel pretty stupid about forgetting to lock the door....and the intruder would most likely be charged with trespassing as opposed to burglary.
If the worlds superpower leaves their doors wide open, they should consider themselves damn lucky that it was a low level hacker like Gary that walked in their doors and if he hadn't, they wouldn't have been alerted and some real terrorists might have caused some very serious damage.
Why can't this supposedly Hi-Tech country secure it's own systems so that amateur hackers can't walk right in "every Day" as admitted by their own people.
Lorna
Wil
Marginal,
As I understand it Gary has always denied causing damage but the US have to claim damage of 5000 dollars before they can prosecute, so magically five thousand dollars damage is claimed by the US on every machine supposedly compromised by Gary.
Hacking should not be an extraditeable offence. He didn't rape or murder anyone but is facing sixty years in an American prison (ten years per. count) and would die there.
A tad out of proportion me thinks.
An English girl named Chantal McKorkle was sentenced to twenty years in America for making infomercials about how to make money from propert. She's served ten years in a High Security prison and recently asked to be repatriated to the UK to serve the rest of her sentence here but was refused by the US authorities because of "the seriousness of the crime"....her American husband is in an open prison but as she's English she's considered a flight risk.
Sentences way out of proportion for non violent crimes are all too common in the US. Murderers and rapists are often given much lower sentences, which is pretty odd.
A lot of Europeans are becoming anti American government because they see them as being so vindictive and over the top and without any sense of fair play.
Michael St.Clair
To Gary and more precisely to Gary's legal team:
As you know there is no actual justice in any of this because you are dealing here in strategic and covert interests to do with things much bigger than laws and lands. We talk here about things such as NASA and secret space programs and the off earth races in contact with black projects at NASA etc.
Therefore, at this point, after the appeal was heard, the best move at this moment on June 17 is in my opinion to publish EVERYTHING which Gary found on the computers of NASA, off earth teams and all.
This is about what the black government inside NASA and the US soil wants to hide, and as I understand it from the video interview Gary gave to Project Camelot, he has now extensive proof of knowledge backing up many of the ponderings of many other experts in this field, such as Dr. Dan Burisch, John Lear et al.
As a strategic response with any kind of effect, I think the legal team and Gary should now consider a vigorous side move and publish all of Gary's findings in main stream media and then see what that will do to the US classified government. The US will say he is a an enemy combatant or terrorist or whatever suits them to claim. You counter this by showing what it is they wish to hide. Then the real discussion begins. You have to front load the public before the proof disappears.
I would also suggest to the legal team to seek counsel with the DCI (Director of Central Intel, known as MJ one) McConnell of the USA, because I hear he is dor the disclosure and behind certain moves to embarass the secret government.
The best you can do now is play the elite of the US against each other. You will not win this by legal manoueverings nor by threatening the US embassy of divulging what you know. You have ONE real chance to stop THEM: You have DEEP knowledge of things the whole planet is entitled to know under any spiritual laws.
Therefore it is your duty and human right to come forward with everything you found out. There is nothing to lose and everything to gain. At least then the world public knows what this is really all about. Don't you?
All this happened for a very good reason, it is part of something much bigger.
Peace & powerful magical prayers for Gary,
and wishes for inspiration to his legal team.
Michael St.Clair - author of Light-Seeds
Sean Steele
Another example of the USA etending thier tenticles around the world to force thier will on those of us who are truely democratic and scialy aware. And then they want imminity from prosecution in Iraq!.
ReggieRarebreed
If the USA can't protect their own systems from the ordinary guy in the street, they basically need sacking for incompetence.
I have worked in the IT industry for well over 20years, and if one of my staff had completed a piece of work that left gaping holes in the network, they would be immediately sacked.
I personally do not believe 10 percent of what the American government tells us, they are a warmongering, lying administration that lets people's of the nations starve to death as they daily make millions of dollars in profit whilst they fight 2 illegal wars. The USA lets bent and corrupt politicians get away then seek to imprison other people who expose their failings. And these guys want to bring in a New World Order, get a grip guys, you can't even look after supposedly 'secure systems', beggars belief that our lapdog government toes that line. Time to stand up and Vote these numpties out..... As John Lennon once said, Power to the People... that's why they killed the man...
Keep fighting the fight Gary, Love n Peace man..
Josephine
What is their problem, the Americans that is, they have been using the art of 'remote viewing' ever since they found the Russians doing likewise. So Gary used a dial-up modem - they really are (Americans) precious.
What they all should be looking at is the fact that they have a 'computer system' that is wanting, for a better word, 'security'. Until they better their system, hackers will continue to push the boundaries to see just how far they can go.
Gary you should be thanked rather than villified for exposing their 'security risks'. Tell them to grow up and devise a better 'system'. Honestly how petty and pathetic, what their problem is that they have been 'caught with their pants down' and they need someone to blame.
Josephine
ziggy
Let HIM FREE!!! HE HAS DONE NOTHING WRONG! IF YOUR SECURITY ISNT UPTO SCRATCH... YOUR LUCKY HES NOT A TERRORIST!! THANK HIM!! PAY HIM! RESPECT HIM!!
Save Gary!
Someone adapt this clip to save Gary from the American Warlords!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMiUQCeBygc#ggviewer-offsite-nav-10105408
smarty
So its ok for the US government to insist "Google" reveals private browsing details about its users - VERY SINISTER
But a lone man who means no real harm to anyone or anything can expect to live out his life in hardship just for - SOME FUN.
The individuals that allowed such a lax security shield on such "Sensitive" information should be the ones facing trial, instead the buck has been well and truly passed over.
If these security "experts" left their car in the street with the keys in the ignition and the windows and doors wide open I assume they would expect to wake up every morning and find the car still where they left it.
This is a classic example (Which highlights the biggest probelm with the USA) of a US firm/individual/Government dept. blaming someone else for their own failings. Its time they started accepting responsibilty for their own mistakes instead of making scapegoats.
I only hope that by some miracle the Lords stand up to this foreign bullying and don't bow in the face of any "Special relationship" or will this be yet another example in an ever lengthening list of British weak kneeism over foreign demands.
Best of luck Gary.
In gnads we trust
Yes the americans are an embarrassment to themselves....
i imagine they want to extradite Gary so they can either brainwash him or use psychological techniques to break him down and render his knowledge useless.
It is absolutely true that regardless of what the do to Gary, the world knows that the sea i ay or whatever dept he hacked are pathetic.... if someone with a dial up connection can walk into their files then there is just no hope for their homeland security.
No one trusts the american govt, and why would you ? they remind me of scientologists in many ways
lol
neon
This guy is obviously very talented, I don't understand why they want to stop him doing what he does best when clearly they can learn so much from him.
Although from what ive heard and seen myself common sense wouldn't go a miss...
solo may be the best and to stop him is crazy.
Best of luck
neon
Sharon
As a US citizen, I say God help Gary if the corrupt, lying, fear mongering, bushitas get hold of him. While Bush himself is merely stupid and oblivious, his puppet strings are being manipulated by some truly evil people including Dick Cheney.
Bear in mind that the US President is Commander & Chief of the military, and it's not a figurehead position by any means.
It's the military that wants Gary's butt for pulling down their knickers in front of the world. This is not to imply that the military of the UK or anywhere else is one bit better behaved.
Even though Gary's legal team shouldn't have a problem stalling things until after the November elections, the next president will be a Republican like Bush.
I take no pleasure in saying this, but there's no way the young upstart Obama can beat an experienced elder statesman like McCain. You can cash that and take it to the bank.
If Gary is extradited to this country, it's very likely he won't get a fair trial even if the government claims otherwise. Like all governments, they lie and break their word as a matter of course.
If there is to be a trial, it should be in the UK. Personally, I thing Gary has suffered more than enough and should be left alone.
My prayers and best wishes are with him.
JOINTHERESISTANCE
mate i have respect for you till the end, you sir are a real truth seeker Gary, put it this way, more people are behind you then against you! GOVERNMENT EMPLOYERS = hundreds of thousands HUMAN CITIZENS/GENERAL PUBLIC = BILLIONS
PUT IT THIS WAY, THERE IS MORE OF US THEN THERE IS OF THEM! FREE GARY AND SPREAD THE TRUTH, MAY GOD HAVE MERCY ON US ALL.
James Sumner
This whole case is pathetic. I have been following this case on and off since it first came about and Gary has had my full support from the beginning. It's a shame that there is not a lot more we can do then to state our support for him, though I'm sure he appreciates knowing exactly how many people are behind him in this.
I have worked in IT, like many people on this site, and can understand entirely why being extradited to the USA to face such an extreme sentence would be overkill.
The people who are saying he should face his sentence "like a man" because he broke the law need to consider the full facts and the whole point of receiving a sentence in the first place. One of the purposes of being sentenced is to help you realise what you did was wrong and make you not want to do it again. After this many years of stress and worry, has he not already had that happen to him? The original sentence of community service would have been MUCH more appropriate when looking at the truth as opposed to the excessively exaggerated version then Americans gave. Maybe the community service could have been to help the Americans secure their government systems? But no... that would embarrass them too much.
Good luck, Gary. I hope you get to see some of the comments published on this site. You have a lot of people who support you who you know about, and many more who you don't.
toneyal
See www.saps08.net
The U.S. has become a nation of slaves.
QA
If you all want to help Gary, spread the word about his situation. Tell your friends about Project Camelot. Educate yourself about exopolitics and what's going on in the black ops community, because it applies to you and your day-to-day quality of life. The reality that is spoon-fed to you is not the true picture, so question everything.